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[DeeMoney]

Great call, I was gonna say the same thing. He is basically forgotten by many today, though he's a HOFer so its hard to say he didn't get the respect he deserved. Also, when Boxingscene did its AT rankings many years ago they rated him the 5th ranked MW all times. I've always been a Freddie Steele ...

[DeeMoney]

Whoosh, geez, right over my head on that one. Thanks for the remind...

[DeeMoney]

Maybe I missed something, or this is a reference I aint picking up on. But I didnt insult anyone.

I write that maybe some boxing fans are so knowledgeable about the sport, that its hard for them to enjoy movies about boxing, because the Hollywood versions will always exaggerate, and the...

[DeeMoney]

I make that joke and show that video in my history class every year...

[DeeMoney]

But then we wouldve lost the Cold War. Soviets saw that even with steroids that they couldnt overcome American grit and determination. Then, when Rocky offered the olive branch- "if I can change, you can change, everyone can change..." well it was over.

You can argue about Glasnost...

[DeeMoney]

The original Rocky was a great movie. I don't know if I'd consider it a boxing movie, its more a story about these noticeably flawed people during 70s America, and how an extraordinary bit of luck changed their lives. They tried to replicate it in Rocky II but couldnt, so just decided to make fun superhero...

[DeeMoney]

No system, I just tallied up the pct of lists (people who voted on this thread) each fighter appeared on. For example, when I counted them up there were seven completed lists Roberto Duran appeared on six of them. 6/7=86%. Just noting how many people voted for them within this thread....

[DeeMoney]

Interesting enough, if you tabulate all those completed top 10s (well, one only had 9) heres what it looks like so far:

Fighter

Pct

...

[DeeMoney]

Damn, good call on Gomez, I wiffed on that one and totally forgot about him and Zarate.

Gomez would make mine and Zarate just on the outside...

[DeeMoney]

Spinks greatness is due to his work at Lt Heavy. Arguably makes the Mt Rushmore of Lt Heavyweights, I rank him mostly due to his work as a Lt Heavy. Not by getting knocked out in the last fight of his career to a prime HOF heavyweight while fighting above his best wt class....

[DeeMoney]

No need to apologize, my fault if I implied that, it was a good digression and I'd love to continue with the way you took the discussion. Its an interesting point of where the line would be. Maybe even within some spots there are athletes and non athletes?

John Kruk famously stated he was,...

[DeeMoney]

Interesting, and good, call on Jack Johnson. Hard to tell with the differences in film speed, but he clearly is fast. I feel like he uses those fast hands to parry away punches more often than to land his own....

[DeeMoney]

I'll be, he still is.

I know I had to remove Sweet Pea and Jofre from my list as I had forgotten that unfortunately they were no longer with us....

[DeeMoney]

In alphabetical order

Julio Cesar Chavez
Roberto Duran
Thomas Hearns
Evander Holyfield
Roy Jones Jr.
Ray Leonard
Finito Lopez
Floyd Mayweather
Manny Pacquiao
Michael Spinks

With Lewis, Holmes, Ward, and Usyk sitting...

[DeeMoney]

Sure, but for this post I just asked for limited athletic ability- which I have thoroughly defined and articulated....

[DeeMoney]

I think the crux of your point boils down very much to the bold portion, but I think you miss the dividing line in your post. Throughout most of the post you allude to dividing sports into two categories: those where the opponent has a direct impact on your performance (Boxing, Baseball, Basketball,...

[DeeMoney]

I get what you are saying, your buddy was a great natural athlete and for certain there are plenty of them who don't get into sports or work out to become one.

I also think you, after I better explained it, get my thoughts in regards to the question. There are several factors that make...

[DeeMoney]

Dont know why you wouldnt post this in the history section, you would get great responses there and lots of good discussion. In fact there is a similar thread there right now (though it is p4p not just heavy).

I think there are two different lines of thought on this. One leads you to Ali,...

[DeeMoney]

Of course strength and stamina are athletic abilities. As are speed, quickness (though that at times can be a deviation of speed), body control, and body type.
Sports are competition which measure, to various extents, athletic ability with some degrees of contrivance.
You mention gymnastics,...

[DeeMoney]

Which is fine, but remember, SRL only fought 8 total fights above welter weight, for which he was 5-2-1, and didn't fight at middle weight til a month off from his 31st birthday. Its not as if he was jumping through weight classes, he was a welterweight until he injured his eye and then missed a few...